spool on the street

[fasttcars]

I "weenied" out and went the Detroit Locker route......

Reading this thread though does make me have second thoughts about my decision, if for no other reason than cost. BIG cost difference between a spool and a D.L., weight savings wouldn't hurt either.

the thing is you are somewhat limited with the spool compared to the locker....for me my car will only be idling down the roads...and no high speed cornering...

[speedymopars]

of course it is ......actually 9 years ago i did some reaserch on it asking all the big hp street spooled cars..and that's what i got...and not just tall but wide...they have a lot more give when turning..plus they don't run super high tire pressure either......i'm not going to think twice about running the spool on the street with my 14x32's....

It would also make sense that the narrower the rear is, the less opposing force there is on the axles and spool. A wide tire on turns has to skate around its own center a little bit, which means there is already less traction than on a skinnier tire. I'm sure if you calculated the number of turns a tire would take around a typical turn, the number would be off if you calculated from the inside of the tire to the outside of the tire by enough to make you wonder how it worked. I feel like doing the math, but I don't have the free time at the moment.

[vitamindart]

i've run a mini w/stock axles and a full w/moser never had any problems , i don't drive in the rain , don't make high speed sharp turns but have driven on the express way with no problems , now if it were more of a cruiser than a drag car i would defenitly spend the extra dough and get a locker or a traction lock its a pain parking with the spool

[Speedy]

plus mini spools are used on a bunch of oval track stuff[one big turn]....

You beat me to it. I just put a spool in my Aspen, it'll be on the street.

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[Bakaruda]

I still say you should not run a spool on a car that is for street only use. Once in a while probaly not going to be a issue. I just think that you need to build the car for the way it is being used. I have seen people run spools on the street and with good axels, they still broke parts. If you have a drag car and run it to the local cruise in on saturday night no problem. Sometimes we just have to agree to disagree.

[fasttcars]

ya you know if the car will be seing more street then strip....the spool isn't as nesesary but for big hp car's like my mild 750hp 440...everything has to be able to handle as much power as possible.....the spool is the strongest of them all....plus myself i plan on adding more power[and still do a lot of street cruzing[just no long distance stuff....i don't believe anything else would survive 1200hp....

[dart_451]

i know i have drivin my dart 7 years, on the street with 14/32 and hooisr quick times, good axles,spool.and alot of HARD street miles and NEVER a problem.but i dont drive it in the rain.

[speedymopars]

HMM should be interesting. My duster definately isn't a daily driver, with 4.30's, 4K stall, reverse manual valve body, no windshield wipers heater or defroster, but it does have a stereo in it - I guess that makes it a street car :-) I drive a whopping 50-55 on the freeway (AKA 3000-3500 RPM :-) and turns, well let's just say any of my lifted 4x4's, my old van towing a fully loaded car trailer , or even my 15000 lb class A RV will smoke the duster on an autocross course :-)

The motor should be good for low 700's in both the HP and torque range, and the 300 HP worth of fogger after that. I think I'll go ahead and build my strange spool and try it out.  If it sucks - you guys will be the first to know.

[dusterdarryl]

no one has picked up that a spool on the street will tend to wear front tyres out quick too from the constact sledging effect of a constact forward push 

[Cudadust]

This creates some public safety thoughts and the negative reputation for all of the Mopar folk. A spool and skinny tires on the front negates all of the safety factors designed in the original suspension.  An air locker spool can be purchased its a peg leg most of the time and a spool when its locked up, this is the best of both worlds. Please do not race on the srtreets older citizens have lower reaction times, slower movements and are increasing in number. Under 25 are more accident prone for various reasons.  The rest of the population deserve to live with law abiding citizens, even considering most of us drive above the popsted speed limit.  If you are building a drag car please drive it at the strip.

[PureGTS]

Worried about breaking axles get a pair of 35 splines and that will go away too. Avoid water/rain, avoid going around corners next to cops, and above all don't ever try to turn the fool thing while you are pushing it! Even if the engine is out of it. It just doesn't work! You have to seak a turn in on it when the spool isn't paying attention. Otherwise just call for the neighbors help and get it over with. Besides you are probably blocking their driveway anyway.

[72dart]

above all don't ever try to turn the fool thing while you are pushing it! Even if the engine is out of it. It just doesn't work! You have to seak a turn in on it when the spool isn't paying attention. Otherwise just call for the neighbors help and get it over with. Besides you are probably blocking their driveway anyway.

, that's very true also.  If your pushing a car with a spool and it has to be turned at all it sucks.

[FastmOp]

Only the slow guys think the locker is better LMAO

I like how easy it is to kick the ass end out wile going around a curve at 100MPH in a school zone

Really though they are harder on tire wear was the major draw back I seen when my car was still tagged.
And the pushing thing my poor riding mower hates pushing my car when it's broke

[speedymopars]

My driveway sits at a 15 degree angle, so I ain't pushing it - EVER

[speedymopars]

This creates some public safety thoughts and the negative reputation for all of the Mopar folk.

How? I would think that my duster will scare most people with or without a spool. At the stop lights, bikes even back down. I never even get the chance to race - even if I wanted to. There are many cars quicker than mine, mine just looks the part. You can be responsible with a race car on the street just as easily as you can be irresponsible with a stock car on the road.  Not all of us want a factory stock vehicle, and not everyone carrying a big stick wants to use it off the drag strip. 

A spool and skinny tires on the front negates all of the safety factors designed in the original suspension. 

So does the 1000 HP 528 ci Keith Black motor (on NOS) and the pro stock scoop that sits 10 inches off of the top of the hood! BTW it is also 19 inches wide and 42 inches long cars can get lost in the blind spot on the right fender! The safety factors are there for the idiots. Always know both you and your car's limitations and act accordingly.

An air locker spool can be purchased its a peg leg most of the time and a spool when its locked up, this is the best of both worlds.

Then the added complexity of an air compressor and the hoses (plus the weight) will kill a drag car. Toyota had a great idea, they had an electric locker - too bad you can't get one for a Mopar. At that point though might as well just get a LSD or locker. The air lockers work great in a 4x4 - sometime you need an open diff to make the turn, but then a spool to get up the cliff. I haven't seen any on a car app. In theory they would work, but it seems like not as well. 4bying needs the extremes, where a drag sorta street car does not. I guess in snow it would be a great thing, but it doesn't snow here.

Please do not race on the srtreets older citizens have lower reaction times, slower movements and are increasing in number. Under 25 are more accident prone for various reasons.  The rest of the population deserve to live with law abiding citizens, even considering most of us drive above the popsted speed limit.  If you are building a drag car please drive it at the strip.

Don't worry. I am not a teenager. As a 40 year old professional that has many of the finer things in life, as well as two young kids and a wife I adore, I have too much to live for. Street racing isn't my thing. My duster is too scary fast for the street anyway - even with my old motor. But after 22 years of driving it this way, I know what I have to look out for.

BTW - I agree with you about the speed limit thing. 99% drive above the speed limit - I know this because with 4.30's and a car that looks like it doesn't belong on the street, I'm the first one to get pulled over if I do ANYTHING wrong. No turn signal, 1MPH over the speed limit, etc, I'm dead. I always under the speed limit, and I am always getting passed from everyone from 70 year olds in thier caddys to teenagers in their hondas. 

[fasttcars]

 ...but i'm 29.......also it's not very pratical for me to have a car that can only be trailered to the track[i don't have a truck or a trailer]....so does this mean i am not suppose to have a high hp car......yes some people[really rich]...punks get carried away with their high hp cars and street racing it's just plain stupid[their is a time and place for low speed jaunts......but just the itimidation factor of having a 700hp plus engine idling down the road with the building's vibrating and earth shaking is more then fun enough.....

[speedymopars]

...but i'm 29...snip....but just the itimidation factor of having a 700hp plus engine idling down the road with the building's vibrating and earth shaking is more then fun enough.....

That IS the best part and has been since I was 18 and driving this thing....

[Q-ship]

"Don't worry. I am not a teenager. As a 40 year old professional that has many of the finer things in life, as well as two young kids and a wife I adore, I have too much to live for. Street racing isn't my thing. My duster is too scary fast for the street anyway - even with my old motor. But after 22 years of driving it this way, I know what I have to look out for."

I really hate for my first post here to be critical, but if you are indeed a 40 year old professional w/wife and kids, then surely you must be aware that your insurance won't cover you if something were to happen while operating your car with illegal parts in it.

There are reasons why a spool is illegal in any street use car as any failure, no matter how unlikely, is guaranteed to cause a catastrophic event. If loosing everything you own (or ever hope to in the future) is worth the couple hundred bucks savings over a legal sure grip/posi unit, then I say you should seriously re-evaluate what is important to you!

A simple blow out, or even a low tire can cause you to make a 90 degree turn into oncoming (innocent) traffic or pedestrians, even at slow cruise speeds. This also is true of a wet spot on the pavement, or water on one tire (normal gutter runoff).

The only thing I can guarantee is that you won't be covered by insurance. You can and will lose everything and still owe money, and that you will feel guilty for the rest of your life for all the misery inflicted on others and your own if you should have a problem.

I work in insurance, and own an agency. I know you think that such a scenario is impossible, but I can assure you that things like this are FAR more common than you could believe. I'm sure that neither you, nor anyone else would disagree that the insurers will hang you out to dry if they have ANYTHING that they can use to eliminate, or limit, their liability.

I won't waste bandwidth with examples, but I assure you CAN lose everything you own, and be in debt for the rest of your life, plus have a lien on your estate (if any), and in a few instances even have a claim on your life insurance.

My suggestion is to keep it street legal even if it's a top fuel dragster. The couple hundred bucks could be the most expensive savings you could ever imagine.

[HB69DART]

Q-ship's post is insightful, albeit possibly biased from a conservative insurance perspective...

My decision to go with a Detroit Locker (DL) vs spool had nothing to do with insurance, more just drawing the line on a parts decision that really would not affect appearance or performance. I knew a DL would be much easier to live with on the street and would still withstand abuse from anything this side of 1000 hp. His post does pose a couple of questions.... First, would an insurance company even consider if a spool was installed when investigating a claim? Second, Q-ships's comment about installing illegal parts.....  Define illegal.  If I have a newer car and install (in CA) non-CARB certified performance equipment, which ARE considered "illegal" modifications, does that mean insurance won't cover it?  The fundamental question for Q-ship is where does his company draw the line on an illegal modification with respect to insured coverage?

[HB69DART]

BTW speedymopars, this is great thread you started     

[Ace]

The fundamental question for Q-ship is where does his company draw the line on an illegal modification with respect to insured coverage?

The answer to that question is that it is at the descrepincy of the insurance company. 

[mopowers]

Where does it say that spools are illegal for use on the street?

[speedymopars]

All good points you bring up, I know insurance companies will take your money, do anything to deny your claim, and then if they have to pay out, raise your rates or cancel your coverage.
Fact of life.

Will the vehicle make a 90 degree turn, that is implying impossible to compensate for, with a blow out? HMM, with a blow out the car is going to want to turn, but to the point where you can't keep it under control? I doubt it but I would really like someone who has experianced that to say. I've been to the track too many times and seen tires schredded without further damage to the vehicle, other than what the slick did. Explorers seemed to like rolling over without a spool, so that can't be the only factor.

Low tire? Well the car is gonna pull....but less than a blow out.

Wet spot on tire or running through water? If I was on the gas and doing a burnout, maybe. It would be just like in the bleach box. Remember I'm on full street tires, not slicks. The issues you discribe would be accurate with wet slicks and a spool on the gas. Or limited slip for that matter. Slicks don't like getting wet, they have a tendancy to lose traction. A good example would be one tire on ice, and the other on dry pavement. The one on the ice isn't going to overpower the one on the dry.

The real question is, if you got to the scene of the accident, and you saw my car, would you disqualify me before you even crawled under it? I do think some of your statements are not completely accurate, or at least I disagree with them, while your statements about the insurance are valid. I also have been trying to find the vehicle code that states spools are illegal - can you point me in the right direction?

In all honesty, if they are actually illegal by the CA vehicle code, that probably would be enough to have me avoid it. If it just boils down to turning while pushing is a bitch, and I have to not run slicks with it on the street, I'll probably do it.

[PureGTS]

  We'll have to go for a ride SpeedyMopars, so I can show you what it's like. It is not "normal" the way the car acts when turning. Accelleration in a turn is suicidal even with big Mickeys out back. No doubt that's why the Cal. V.C. doesn't like them.
  Tire wear is a definite issue. Fortunatly I don't do much street driving with it. Although if I can get the exhaust back on I will probably go back to one of my old haunts and help support the only other Mopar guy that was there the last time I went through. He looked out of place in an ocean of chebbies.

[speedymopars]

Between Q-Ship, cudadust and PureGTS, it's making me think it may not be worth the hassle....(and you guys probably thought I was ignoring your comments)...

[446jeff]

Where does it say that spools are illegal for use on the street?

i was wondering where that law,rule or clause was myself.
i have a spool in my B-body & if i drive it on the street i take the responsibility of possible driveline problems.i've seen many other aftermarket parts that have failed & this is the risk you take.look at all the recalls that happen from oem manufacturers.

[FastmOp]

LMAO when that detroit locker, grabs one side harder then the other and you stick it in the wall before the christmas tree.
Big tires, the launch pad, and VHT = needs a spool if your makeing any kind of power.

[HB69DART]

LMAO when that detroit locker, grabs one side harder then the other and you stick it in the wall before the christmas tree.
Big tires, the launch pad, and VHT = needs a spool if your makeing any kind of power.

I guess I forgot you need a spool to run at the track. My car is not a race-only car. If it were I'd put a spool in it. To say you can't run at the track safely without a spool is hogwash.

[FastmOp]

you better soap up your piggy then since you say you cant run a spool on the street

An 11 sec car can get buy with it, but once you start making real power and running hard watch what happens. You ever went in the 1.40's in sixty feet with a locker? I have and know 1st hand what happens when one tire hooks harder then the other. the hooking tire drives you out of the groove, then the lesshooking tire has even less traction. and it gets crossed up in a hurry.
You ever drive a spool on the street? I have and wile it's a pita to park and a little harder on tires it's also no big deal and you never even know it's back there most of the time. To the point that if I didnt tell you it was in there you would never know it.
A locker is ok for slow stuff, but once you get into the power range the poster is talking about, KB block, tunnelram, nitrous, etc. it's really a no brainer.
Now back to the garage and building race stuff.

[NYrr496]

I've never had a spool in a street car, but I knew a guy that did. The car was definately a handful. I build my stuff to be as managable and comfortable as possible. If a Detroit Locker can handle the power you're making, I would go with that. The last thing you need is to have that thing get away from you because of some small mishap that usually would mean nothing.