Before we F@#Kup!

[67Dart383]

The KIDD and I was thinking we need more fresh air.This motor seems to really grunt with some cool air! So we have built a carb pan/shield that will sit on top of carb and seal to the cowl hood  . We haven't tried it out yet because of rain outs at the tracks.But thursday we might get a shot!  Now this is where the F@#kup might happen! I was thinking about cutting a 4" hole on each side of inner fender toward the back , then run 4" vent hose to carb pan. My thinking that the air being pushed up by the rotation of front tires would  go thru the vent hose and into carb pan creating more air flow than just pan sealed to cowl!  We don't  want to run vent hose to front of grill to ugly!   So are we on to something!!                Before we F@#kup!                     Mopar Teacher, Help!     Anyone Help!!         

[Tejas]

That cowl hood you have is one of the best hood scoop designs out there.
The only thing you may pick up from running it like you described are rocks and road debris, don't do it.
Seal it to the hood!

[67Dart383]

This setup will only be ran at the track, we can cap it off when we don't run it at the track.

[Tejas]

The cowl hood scoop is designed to pull in the cool, still air at the base of the windshield, it creates a high pressure area there.
If you try to pull it in from the wheel wells it will be hot turbulent air and may have no positive effect at all.
My two cents!

[west]

Im not sure how much air that cowl brings in but there is a chance by sealing it with a pan you may actually restrict air to the carb because it would be getting air only from the cowl and nowhere else.

[hemicop]

  Tejas is right-on, and I don't know of any "dirt=free" tracks. If you're so interested in this, I suggest you get a copy of Mopar's chassis book as they have a chapter in there on aerodynamics & explains their philosophy on hoodscoop design.

[flyboy01]

I agree cowl hoods are an excellent design, NASCAR used this design for cars running 200 mph. If you use a hose, then you want to seal the air cleaner assy and get the air from a high pressure spot in front of the car, like under the bumper and grill area. The wheel wekks are a low pressure area and may suck air out, also you get a LOT of dirt from that area. Air is not like water, it will not "fling" off the tire, instead you need to think of it in terms of Low and high pressure areas. Low will suck, high will push, generally all areas under the car and in puckets are low pressure, in front and above the car are high pressure, also, air is cooler above the road, than at the surface. Use the cowl for how it was designed, seal it off from under the hood air and you will be ahead of the game.

[fasttcars]

 ...& just keep it simple......don't bother with the front ducks ...just pull from the cowl.........i mean you could test it to see if it does anything...but   just the cowl air by itself  works awesome on  1000hp plus engine's

[illfish]

The headers will also heat the tube as it passes to the fender area.  Plus the added weight of the tubing and parts.  Plus the 90 degree bends.  The cowl ALWAYS works the best. 

[flyboy01]

If you want to test it, install the pan, seal it off, and tape a few pieces of 2" yarn to the back edge of the scoop. You can see them pulled into it when you drive down the road. I tried it with my scoop on my dakota I did a few years back.

[chryco]

...& just keep it simple......don't bother with the front ducks ...just pull from the cowl.........i mean you could test it to see if it does anything...but   just the cowl air by itself  works awesome on  1000hp plus engine's

 

[dangerdawg]

...& just keep it simple......don't bother with the front ducks ...just pull from the cowl.........i mean you could test it to see if it does anything...but just the cowl air by itself works awesome on 1000hp plus engine's

 

                                                                                                                                                     

[AdamR]

A cowl hood really needs to be closer to the windshield to work properly.

[fasttcars]

A cowl hood really needs to be closer to the windshield to work properly.

..ya i should have looked at the pic's closer..cuz he's right........can we have some close up shots of the cowl hood......it does appear to be slightly far away....

[signet]

you have 2 things to use to your advantage with the cowl.

one is the air is cooler and two it is at speed,pressurized.

cool is good and simple but pressurized needs to have the mixture on the rich side at low speed.
fuel injection could automaticly adjust but you have a carb.

[67Dart383]

A cowl hood really needs to be closer to the windshield to work properly.

..ya i should have looked at the pic's closer..cuz he's right........can we have some close up shots of the cowl hood......it does appear to be slightly far away....

Here is another picture that I took on top of car. Just click the link.
http://www.cardomain.com/member_pages/show_image.pl?bg=FFFFFF&image=http://memimage.cardomain.net/member_images/9/web/2349000-2349999/2349068_7_full.jpg

[Matt-67]

Cutting that car won't be worth it.   That car is nice and you will regret those holes cut in the fender.  Don't try to get free horsepower, it doesn't exist.  That's why I built a .  Which by the way still isn't as fast as yours.  Imagine looking at them holes after you run the same ET.

[fasttcars]

now i'm not any expert on the exact dimention's the scoop should be or anything but knowing how the scoops are on the fast cars  it looks as if the sides of the cowl should be brought back more[fiberglass] toward windowso as the air just dosent  pass right by  and actually goes in under pressure...but again i'm not exactly a expert on this

[moparrr07]

my dad did a combo of those two ideas, he took a duel outlet stock air cleaner and ran two hoses and cut two holes into the actual cowl of the car, and took air in from the cowl with a stock hood, and that ran in the high 11s but upgrade to a 6pack scoop when he ran into the low 10s

[fasttcars]

my dad did a combo of those two ideas, he took a duel outlet stock air cleaner and ran two hoses and cut two holes into the actual cowl of the car, and took air in from the cowl with a stock hood, and that ran in the high 11s but upgrade to a 6pack scoop when he ran into the low 10s

running a forward scoop isn't really a upgrade  over a cowl hood considering a forward scoop is also aerodynamically bad  in comparison.....

[Poison_Dart]

I'm not sure if this has been mentioned or not.. I kinda just read over the topic,, but to use air from the fender wells
would seem to me is hot air pick up from the asfault and heat from the tires, i agree that the cowl induction is very adequate, Although! you still get a certain amount of heat rise up from the engine radiated through the hood.the trick is to capture the air at a place where it has least been heated up, Back when I had my '74 camaro I used a air induction system from the chin spoiler that was down at around 6 inches from pavment , I was told to rise the system up higher into the grill, so I did  and sure enough I seen a big difference in torque, were as used to when the secoundary's came in I could hear them open but couldn't really feel any more power , but when I moved the induction up to capture the colder air I could hear the 4 kick in and feel the torque as well..  I am no race car person but I do like to get the most performance out of a car that can be  the el-cheap-o-way and the colder the air the more torque at high speeds can be made, so where ever you put it if not front or cowl be sure the air in that particular place is cool air.

[illfish]

From the high 11's to the low 10's with just an air cleaner change?

[flyboy01]

You guys are over analyzing this. A cowl does work, general rule of thumb is that the height of the cowl determines the distance from the windsheild. Since that is a tall cowl, it should be OK. Racecars suck the cowl right back to the window for aerodynamics, because most cars that use 8" tall cowls tend to be going over 150mph at the end of the 1/4. Remember that the dart has a high pressure area at the base of the windsheild because the cowl vent for the ventilation system is there, and it extends forward to the hood.

DO a simple experiment that will take you 5 minutes. Tape some yarn (or string) to the back edge of the scoop and and the base of the cowl panel and go drive down the road. If the yarn sucks into the scoop, then it will work. If it flows back then either the seal is not tight enough or there is a low pressure area behind the scoop.

5 minutes of testing beats 2 days of speculation on this forum.

[fasttcars]

and just to add the grill is the highest pressure area...

[brg1966]

I don't know about the cowl hoods.  But I do know from testing that an air pan is worth a tenth in the 1/4 mile. 

[Supershafts]

   Do you guy's really own darts? ? ? ? 

   Lets see.......

    Try opening the vent...you know the manual one down by your leg there....yeah that's it! ! ! ! and now go for a ride picking up speed as you go and that should remind you why it's closed and then answer your question on if it works.....

     It would work better with hose running to the cowl area in the firewall and used like that without that gm thing on top and no one will see it having hose go from the cowl to the carb..

   

[fasttcars]

   Do you guy's really own darts? ? ? ? 

   Lets see.......
 
    Try opening the vent...you know the manual one down by your leg there....yeah that's it! ! ! ! and now go for a ride picking up speed as you go and that should remind you why it's closed and then answer your question on if it works.....

       

well duh ....we already know  that it works...more or less making work the most efficiently

[Supershafts]

      The faster you go the better it works....So if you want it to work better get above 85mph as fast as you can...because until then it's not going to work with any efficiency as per the helping the motor..
     

[moparrr07]

From the high 11's to the low 10's with just an air cleaner change?

no

[540dust]

Why would a cowl hood work better than a forward facing scoop?  NASCAR is forced to use this type, Pro stock is not, .... just a thought to ponder.