Competition Engineering rear 4-link or ladder bar kit???

[zpsull01]

I am building a 72 Duster and am trying to set up the rear suspension. I have the car completely stripped and have most of the trunk cut out for repair and tubbing. I was planning on moving the springs in to at least the frame or within the frame rails with some custom fabrication. I have however been looking at the rear frame 4 link kit from competition engineering though. I would like to have the 4 link and the coil overs but is this setup right for what I'm doing? Or should I run ladder bars for the street?

I am building this car to basically be a strip car without the huge powerplant up front. The car is going to be mostly street driven for the first couple of years then as I upgrade the engine it will see much more of the strip. Right now the car is in parts but I have a mild 500-550hp 440, custom built 727(on the way), a Dana 60 waiting to narrowed with a 3.73 posi and a full 12 point cage. I'm going to run this setup for a while and get all the small things fixed while I save up and build an aluminum blocked 543 with some sort of forced induction.

But like I said I'm doing all the tubbing and chassis build-up now. So, should I get the 24", 26", or 28" kit and is this going to be streetable? I plan on running at least 10" wide tires on the street but I would like the capability to throw some 15"+ slicks back there down the road. 

[mrbill00]

have you looked at the RMS-reilly guy's site? he has an a-body specific
4 link triangular something or other setup with either coil over or air support/and they
cater to big block/a body's in particular
by the way 500 hp 440's aren't real small 

[zpsull01]

The main selling point on this kit to me is that it has an overall width of 24, 26, or 28 inches. Since the factory rails have a width of 37.75"s this is a huge gain in possibly tire width. The main reason I'm looking at this is for the suspension set up and tire clearance. And I know that a 500hp 440 isn't small but my goal is to have around 8-900hp on just a 540+ci engine plus have a blower or turbo on top of that. I am building this car now to handle that type of power so I don't have to change everything down the road.

[zpsull01]

And I'm not seeing any kind of set up for the rear on the RMS site?

[Prodart]

Why do you want four link?? Ladderbar is easier to tune for the street in my .02 

[zpsull01]

Really...I was under the impression that a ladder bar set up was mainly for the strip and a 4-link worked better all around. Maybe I had that backwards. Either way I am going to want the most streetable set-up.

[VTI]

i am thinking the same way. was told by a chassi shop to read the book doorslammers by dave morgan before i did anything. it was very very helpfull and made my decision a more informitive one. can't say enough about the book. got it through amazon.com. 

[doug 371]

the 4 link is quieter on the street than the ladder bars

[mrbill00]

check out the post above this one called "check out my RMS.........". it has some pics
and usage discussion. i didn't find it on ther website either. most of the folks i see at the
strip are phasing out of the ladder bars to 4 link. i don't know about for the street other
than what abody joe talks about as my usage in the future will be mostly for the street
(with maybe a random test and tune night)

[NYrr496]

i am thinking the same way. was told by a chassi shop to read the book doorslammers by dave morgan before i did anything. it was very very helpfull and made my decision a more informitive one. can't say enough about the book. got it through amazon.com. 

I have that book. It's a wealth of information. Got it at the Speed shop.

[zpsull01]

Yea thats a really nice set up and stuff but that still isn't allowing more room for wider tires. I only have 13" from the edge of the fender to the frame rail. I am wanting to move them in and make room for at least 15-17" slicks for later on down the road. I figure that this is the perfect time to do it since the car is stripped and in parts now. I am only going to run a 10" or so tire on the street but I want to have the capalbilty to throw some huge slicks under there.

[NYrr496]

My friend James used to have a Volare with ladder bars, but the car retained the leaf springs. He ran floaters so the rear could roll on the springs. It worked really well but I feel he would have gained so much more had he added coil springs.

[Sixpak]

There are MUCH better 4 link or ladder bar kits out there than Competition Engineering's stuff. Look at Chassis Engineering, Ed Quay, Art Morrison, Chris Alston's Chassisworks.  I installed a Chassis Engineering 4 link, narrowed frame rails and 12 pt cage in a 70 Dart and it went very well. Comp engineerings stuff, last time I looked, looked primitive, crude, compared to the ones mentioned above. It's like their stuff was designed in the late 70's early 80's and has never been improved on or updated.
A ladder bar is easier to adjust and gets you up and running quicker, but is less adjustable than a 4 link. If you have the patience to adjust a 4 link and want every bit of bite you can get, go for the 4 link. It is also a bit more flexible than a ladder bar, but you need to use a wishbone for best results. It will allow the rear to roll rotate, which a diagonal link will not do. A ladder bar typically uses solid rod ends, so there's no roll rotation like you'd get with the heim joints in a 4 link.

[acpat]

  ladder bar can not roll so it binds going in parking lots itc. I would do 4 link

[illfish]

4 link for sure.  With what you are planning, it's probably the best way to go.  You'll be able to change the instant center to a larger number of positions to suit the track and street. 

[zpsull01]

Well I have checked out all of the other brands mentioned and I do see some major differences in some but that is also shown in the price as well. Besides those that are obviously better build, which is alittle more than what I'm looking for, what is so out dated and bad about the competition engineering kit? I like the fact that it is already jig welded together. Many of the other brands are in parts. Also I am worried about the fitment of any of these kits. How well are they going to match my Duster? I know that there is going to have to be some modification but is this going to be major work of just putting some time into it?

[illfish]

I've been pretty happy with the Alston stuff.  McAmis makes good stuff too.  With 4 link/ladder setups you have to expect some custom fab work to get it right. 

[zpsull01]

I know that it is going to be some pretty serious fabrication but I'm worried about how the curves will line up to what they are now. I have the trunk mostly cut out but I'm concerned with where the frame rails will meet the rear of the car, as in way down by the bumper or raised up in the trunk.

Any input on this?

[illfish]

I would think that with the trunk cut out, you can pretty much put them where you want and then fab the pan in the trunk.  Obviously making sure the rails are level though. 

[rjsjea]

Call Bill Reilly (RMS).....he's a great source for information.  His 4-link will require the least fabrication and price wise it in line with the others.  Plus will take the least fabrication to install since it's designed for an A-body

[zpsull01]

Does his come with the frame rails, coil overs, and everything like the other kits do?

[rjsjea]

Maybe Bill or a-body Joe will chime in.....but I think it comes w/ shocks (or bags) but no frame rails.  Abody Joe has a sticky of his install up top

[zpsull01]

That kit is a nice kit, but it doesn't help me make room for larger tires. I am wanting these kits because they move the frame rails in and they solve all my other suspension problems since they come with it. I'm wanting to be able to run a 15" wide slick back there.

[sbduster44]

it depends on what you want to do MOSTLY with the car.  If you want to run it mostly at the strip, and on the street sometimes, i dont see why you wouldn't wwat to go with a 4 -link from comp engineering.  Tri- 4 links are aimed mostly for handling street cars, where the 4 link kaunches you hard and makes room for those fat slicks you want

[zpsull01]

Well it is going to be mostly street driven until I get everything worked out to where I'm ready to take it to the track then it will see much more time there. My plans for this one is to build a streetable drag car, but mainly strip. I want the 4 link but the only issues that I'm running into are that of fitment and Sixpaks post about how outdated the comp. engineering kits were. These are the two things that I would like more info on if anyone can help.

[hemicop]

  Keep in mind that all the products everyone mentioned is (are?) good stuff and while you're eventually going to make your car primarily a drag car, the only REAL advantage to a 4-link is adjustability. Now if you're going to go from track to track where traction can be an issue I'd say go for the 4-link. But if you're like most guys who frequent one, maybe two dragstrips a ladder bar set-up would be cheaper & easier, IMO.

[Ciscodog]

ladder bar can not roll so it binds going in parking lots itc. I would do 4 link

  Are you kidding?  I'd be happy to put a jack under one tire and show you exactly how much it can roll.  If it's set up properly with the misalignment bushings, etc. it will have plenty of angular travel and it will go in and out of parking lots just fine.

Someone else commented on noise - if you can hear suspension over the exhaust your ears are pretty good. 

Don't go with the comp engineering stuff.  Get it from S&W, Art Morisson or Chassisworks or Chassis Engineering.  Quartermax makes some good stuff too.

Ladders -vs- 4-link?  4-Link is just more tunable.  The rest is the same.

[poppopmadman]

I have a Bears performance dana 60 complete! No issues!!
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