chrysler 9 1/4 in an A-Body

[yellowsno]

I am narrowing a 9.25 rear axle for my 67 dart. I am currious why the pinion yolk is off center.  And I am wondering how much and if it really matters?

[yellowsno]

I am narrowing the 9.25 and the 7.25 is offset by what I can tell .5-1.5 inches.    Im kinda lost.  I know what I have to do to narrow it but the offset is stoping me.

[b569rr]

Its offset to match the offset of the engine / trans towards the passenger side.

[yellowsno]

so how much is the offset?  is it differrent between the 904 and the 727 trans.?

[b569rr]

1. http://www.bigblockdart.com/index.php/topic,17836.0.html

2. No

[Jamakin]

i thought the 9 1/4 couldn't be cut down due to the axles being tapored?

[MyCreation68]

I know the axle tubes are tapered but I don't know if the axles are.

[yellowsno]

I have to get custom ones from moser or make my own
I have the equipment to make some
but the offset is the thing that is stoping me from from getting further
I think it is .75 inch not sure though.
going to check out link....

[yellowsno]

Im understanding that it doesnt really matter
Thats why the man made u joints
4x4 trucks have huce angles on their u joints and they work? dont they?
and they say that the needle bearings have to keep moving
so a little off is good than...?
huh...

[MyCreation68]

to much u-joint angle makes    personally measure the housing. I'm still against using the 9.25 rear axle but it's your car and your decision.

[smallbigblock]

Please let us know how your install is going, and add some pics. 
I too am debating about using the 9 1/4 and here are my reasons:

     1. They are cheap and very available
     2.  Parts and labor to work on them is cheaper than 8 3/4
     3.  Local shops still know how to set them up (I know nothing)
     4.  They are very strong

I would love to have an 8 3/4 but here in the great northwest they are not very abundant, and when you do find them they cost a fortune.

I know the 9 1/4 is strong from personnel experience.   

[MyCreation68]

I know the 9 1/4 is strong from personnel experience.   

Not as strong as you may think. When I actually get to putting a diesel in my ramcharger(who knows when) I'll have replaced the rear 9 1/4 with a Dana 70 and the front Dana 44 with a Dana 60.

Actually I almost blew my rearend up in my SS/T(9 1/4) just doing burnouts with a stock motor.

[jamesdart]

how do you "alomst blow your rear up? either it broke or it didnt?  the 9 1/4 is plenty strong, the problem with putting a truck housing in a car is the tapered tubes which is not a big deal when you stick the jig through it, it holds everything in place. if the housing ends fit inside the tubes, there is nothing wrong with that. you want a little more or a little less offset than the transmision, the driveshaft should have a slight offset side to side so the ujoint bearings are always moving in both directions.

[Capt Jack]

Actually I almost blew my rearend up in my SS/T(9 1/4) just doing burnouts with a stock motor.

ditto for my SS/T.  a few hard burnouts and my 9.25 was howling like a wounded coyote.
thank god it was still under warranty.

however, hasnt done it since it was repaired.

[joesnow]

I would not use a 9 1/4 rear. Just my 2 cents. I had one in my '86 w100. Bears howed from new, then after they were fixed, then I had the gears changed from 3.23 to 3.91 and a factory limited slip. Then blow the springs out of the carrier.I then went with a dana 60. The truck was just a 318 2bl a/t with 33's. I have heard of quite a few 1500 with the rears going. I bought a 2500 this time. I would not waste my time with a 9 1/4 , I would look for a truck 60 or a bare 8 3/4 and have it shipped. It should not be that much empty.

[abqdart]

8.8 Ford rear out of a mid-late 90's Explorer, Ranger......31 Spline axles, Trac-loc good gears...disk brakes all for under $300

[smallbigblock]

Well I can't argue how or if Chrysler changed the way they manufactured the 9 1/4 over the years, but I can say without hesitation that the 9 1/4's I have had where much stronger than the above examples.  I bought a new 1978 dodge PW with a 440 from the factory, yah I know very low HP but still with respectable torque.  Just after the 1 year warranty was up, I built a 69 440 with the help of a local racer that had a big shop in our area, Grant Springer.  This thing was better than my 68 roadrunner.  It was fast, and I didn’t fret about pulling the trigger.  I was young but I dove that truck like it belonged to my rich uncle (nope, no respect).  I really abused that thing.  Once during an ice storm I tried to drive my wife’s Volvo up a long ice covered hill.  Well I got about 300 yards up the mile and a quarter hill and it wouldn’t go anymore.  It was too icy to back down and we needed the car.  Brilliant idea I’ll just pull it up the rest of the hill with my dodge right?  Well I did, but it was a process of spin the tires on the ice until the tire got traction all the way up the hill.  This took about a hour but we made it. The next day I had $900 bill to replace my front end.  This is only a sample of the torture that I put this 9 ¼ through.  I kept that truck for thirteen years and about 200,000 miles I never touched the rearend, except to put a lifting block and longer u-bolts under it.  My brother has a 77 same as mine except with a littler hotter cam and lower gears 3.92’s.  He still owns that truck today, and he was and is harder on it than I was on mine.

I have had other 9 ¼’s since then and I have done many burn-outs and I have not had one problem with this rearend.

Sorry for the long post, I just want to set the record straight.

[Tacfire11]

8.8 Ford rear out of a mid-late 90's Explorer, Ranger......31 Spline axles, Trac-loc good gears...disk brakes all for under $300

Ditto - Even cutting down the Axle tubes, new Axles, disc brakes, and new lines still came in under $300, plus you get them for a song at the local salvage yard.  Posi-Trac sections aren't bad either, about $300 from Summit of mancini if you want a new one. 

[MyCreation68]

Well I can't argue how or if Chrysler changed the way they manufactured the 9 1/4 over the years, but I can say without hesitation that the 9 1/4's I have had where much stronger than the above examples.  I bought a new 1978 dodge PW with a 440 from the factory, yah I know very low HP but still with respectable torque.  Just after the 1 year warranty was up, I built a 69 440 with the help of a local racer that had a big shop in our area, Grant Springer.  This thing was better than my 68 roadrunner.  It was fast, and I didn’t fret about pulling the trigger.  I was young but I dove that truck like it belonged to my rich uncle (nope, no respect).  I really abused that thing.  Once during an ice storm I tried to drive my wife’s Volvo up a long ice covered hill.  Well I got about 300 yards up the mile and a quarter hill and it wouldn’t go anymore.  It was too icy to back down and we needed the car.  Brilliant idea I’ll just pull it up the rest of the hill with my dodge right?  Well I did, but it was a process of spin the tires on the ice until the tire got traction all the way up the hill.  This took about a hour but we made it. The next day I had $900 bill to replace my front end.  This is only a sample of the torture that I put this 9 ¼ through.  I kept that truck for thirteen years and about 200,000 miles I never touched the rearend, except to put a lifting block and longer u-bolts under it.  My brother has a 77 same as mine except with a littler hotter cam and lower gears 3.92’s.  He still owns that truck today, and he was and is harder on it than I was on mine.

I have had other 9 ¼’s since then and I have done many burn-outs and I have not had one problem with this rearend.

Sorry for the long post, I just want to set the record straight.

Sorry but I've driven my truck hard but not as hard as a 600 hp engine would. My truck has a 98 5.9 with 245 hp stock and once I start putting money into more hp the rearends getting replace by a Dana 60 because I don't feel like getting the rear fixed.

I mean who knows maybe it's whoever does the buildup of that rearend but I've got a 9 1/4 in my 84 ramcharger(engine has 147 hp and I am already developing a howl) and the one in my SST and I'd never build one up so who knows if you want my old one in spring sometime come get it because when I get my 8 lug dana 60 the 9 1/4 will be unceremoniously tossed into the backyard.

[Tacfire11]

   - Man, didn't realize you were putting that much power to the wheels   Obvisously not going to be daily driver .  Good Luck, not sure what rear the Durango has in it, but they are about the same width as an A body, you may just have to cut off the shock mounts, and of course have new axles cut.   Best of luck, please post some pictures when you get her finished.  Hope you have a Happy Holiday...

Pat

[buck440]

been running a narrowed 9 1/4 for about two years now with no problems 12.09 at 111

[acpat]

 

[flyboy01]

What about running am 8.8 Mustang 5-lug axle? Its drum, 5-lug, and I thought the same width.

[MyCreation68]

What about running am 8.8 Mustang 5-lug axle? Its drum, 5-lug, and I thought the same width.

96-00 explorer,mustang, ranger all have the same width rear and discs with e brake. and they are an almost perfect fit in an abody.

[jg]

What is the total width of the Ford 8.8 between the wheel mounting surfaces?

[flyboy01]

What about Dana 35 or 44 for rears, these seem to be easy to find on craigslist. They use them in 4x4's, do they hold up on the street?

[PunKid]

What about running am 8.8 Mustang 5-lug axle? Its drum, 5-lug, and I thought the same width.

96-00 explorer,mustang, ranger all have the same width rear and discs with e brake. and they are an almost perfect fit in an abody.

 

[440GoldDuster]

Hey Guys and Gals, new to this site and was very interested in hearing more about an 8.8 Ford rear in an A-Body.
I have a '74 Gold Duster 440/727 and think this is a good option for me as I'm putting this thing together on the
cheap or as cheap as I can! I've been working on it for about 5 years now and its due time to finish it up. Still have
7-1/4 /6 rear, 9'' drums up front etc. but I have had it out on the road a couple times and its an absolute handfull
just the way I like it. Has anyone done it yet? If so tell me how it went please. Any cheap aftermarket front disc kits
out there? Maybe ones where I won't have to change my spindles etc. Thanks!

[BIG DOG]

What about running am 8.8 Mustang 5-lug axle? Its drum, 5-lug, and I thought the same width.

96-00 explorer,mustang, ranger all have the same width rear and discs with e brake. and they are an almost perfect fit in an abody.

 

I believe the way to go also.They are cheap to find at a junk yard have good parts avaiability and the ford guys are running under 10 sec with them.

[flyboy01]

I am interested in swapping one (8.8 rear) into my 75 Dart since I have a 7 1/4 in it now. Anyone have any pics, info, parts list, etc? How does the driveshaft work out?

[67Dart34dr0]

Let's back up here a bit.

Dana 35 is a decent rear end for a car. About equivalent to an 8-1/4" if I recall correctly, parts are available to toughen these up and they can be had for chump-change. So is a 44. The 44s are like most 8-3/4"s in cars. The 35s break on the trail because it is a LOT of stress for any rear.

One could be had out of a XJ cheap enough. Move the perches out 1.5" either side, and since it is a MoPar rear used with MoPar transmissions, it'd be a fairly simple swap. Lots of 'em use discs too.

For the Ford rear, probably the easiest thing would be a custom u-joint setup to convert from the Ford rear to the Chrysler trans. (swap is often done in XJs so it shouldn't be too hard to find one from a 4x4 supply place)

[BIG DOG]

If I remember correctly the 8.8 out of a Ford Exploder are 1/2 wider than the Abody 8 3/4 .Can be found with 3.73 or 4.10 gears and all or most are posi. and come with disc brakes.They also have a good aftermarket supply c clip eliminator some welding on the housing and a aluminum cover that reinforces the bearings in the diff make it a very strong unit.

[67Dart34dr0]

I'm pretty sure the perches are off on the Explorer.

Some early Mustangs have rears that will bolt right into A bodies. Early cougars are the real gold mine though. 

[frostnettenes]

A Ford rear in an A-body Mopar is about as blasphemous as dropping a smallblock Chevy into it, IMO. They fit, yes. How could you tell someone that your Duster just roasted a Mustang, when part of your car is basically a part of the one you just beat? The day I bought my '73 Duster 340, it was sitting next to a 1952 Dodge 1/2 ton in beautiful condition. I could have had either for $650. I went for the truck... until I popped the hood and saw the 283 under it. I told the guy I wouldn't buy the truck unless he yanked the engine out of it. He got offended, and I got the Duster. Some people have no problem with putting brand X stuff in their Mopes, but not I. Stick with the 9 1/4!

[67Dart34dr0]

A Chevy engine in a Dodge is much different than a Ford rear in a Dodge. Think about all the Rangers and Ford-built Mazda trucks with 318s. Ford and Dodge do have a lot of swapping, and it isn't a bad thing.

Is it any different than an early Chrysler Hemi in a Dodge? I don't really think so. (the Ford rear part, not the Chevy engine. Chevy engine bad, Ford rear good)

[frostnettenes]

It's a conviction that I hold very dearly, actually. Mopar parts should go on a Mopar. A Desoto hemi in a Diplomat is still a Mopar part in a Mopar. Although nobody cares any more for my opinion than any one else's, I always have and always will blow a car off if it's equipped with a brand x part. I detest FoMoCo and GM. If you commend putting a part from one of their vehicles into a Dodge, you are attesting to the durability and giving a thumbs-up to a competitor's product. Let us say, hypothetically, that you have a 496 in a 'Cuda, dressed to the nines, with a trans adapter and running a Powerglide. A Camaro freak sees it- he now has a bunch of laughter at your expense because he views it as NEEDING that Powerglide because it's better than a 727. My feelings on guys with Rangers dropping in 318's in them- scrap the truck, buy a Dakota. To be honest, I think the guy wanting to cut down a 9.25 should just save a little more and either get an 8.75 or splurge and get a Dana 60. He's putting the same amount of effort into the swap, and an 8.75 makes it much easier to change out gearsets if he isn't satisfied. I could never afford even a rotten '69 Coronet, let alone a pristine '69 GSS Dart, but my dedication is just the same as a millionaire's. It's probably a part of the Mopar Action versus Mopar Muscle mentalities; I have a twisted sense of humor and agree with Richard Ehrenberg- if it came from Ma, it's a treasure, if it came from Generic Motors, it's much more useful as a tree durability tester. You can't please everyone (hell, I can't even please anyone), but I wouldn't want something like that on my conscience on my deathbed.

[frostnettenes]

I just read my last response over again... I hope I'm not sounding like an arse, as I definitely don't mean to. I love my son, my wife, my music and my cars, and I guess my affection for them makes me stand up for them pretty firmly. I'm still a newbie here and sure as hell don't want to wear out my welcome yet! Just  me if you feel the need! Haha.

[flyboy01]

Part of the problem with your theory, more Dana 60 were installed in Fords that even in a Mopar, so if we use mopar only rears, then its an 8 3/4 only, so what wrong with a ford rear, what about abodyjoe, he is running ford wheels on a Mopar, some people run GM disc brakes on theri 8 3/4's. Honestly, I am a Mopar-or-no-car man myself, but so much stuff is non mopar, it hardly matters. If a mopar can kick the arse of a Mustang using an 8.8 rear end, whats the harm?

ANother thing to consider, I have been looking for an 8 3/4 A-body housing for 2 years, I have the axles, backing plates, carrier, and two sets of drums, but still no housing, since they are as rare as hen's teeth, I am starting to look and the 8.8 rears as a viable choice. Especially since it is easier than cutting down a 9 1/4 or B-body rear. And as of last check, I found a 3.73 LS 8.8 rear with brakes for $200 on Craigslist last week.

[frostnettenes]

I wouldn't say it is a theory, just personal preference and opinion. Dana doesn't belong to either company, and a cut Dana looks like a Dana. An 8.8 Ford looks like a Ford no matter how you look at it. I was lucky and had an 8.75 A-body rear given to me a few years ago (along with the '71 Scamp it came under). I know they are rare, for sure. But it's still super easy to find an old Dodge truck or van with an 8.75 and have it cut down. I'd be more than thrilled to trade the complete rear I have for a cut-down Dana 60, but then again... who wouldn't? Some people aren't as judgemental when it comes to polluting their cars with parts from other companies. As I said, my opinion isn't really that important to anyone else, but it's something I adhere to. The 8.75 will sit where it is until I get the $700+ to buy axles/gears/Sure Grip to complete it. I could very easily sell it as-is for $200, go to a junk yard and grab a 4.10 Explorer rear for the same price, spend less than $100 to get it under the car and have nearly the same result. $700 is nowhere NEAR pocket change for me... that's something I can't even afford with a six-month plan. But instead of taking the cheap way out, my car will do without for however long it will take me to save up that much to get it done the right way. Am I being a little extreme? I definitely don't think so. It's in a garage, so it's not suffering from neglect because of a technicality. If I make the call from the horizontal phone booth before it's finished, it'll be there for my son. After I join the Choir Invisible, he can throw a Yugo rear under it if he likes... but I think he'll be raised better than that. 

[67Dart34dr0]

You know my '77 came from the factory with a GM column and a GM brake booster? Lots of these cars did. I think the general stuff that is unavoidable, so be it.

I wouldn't cut down a 9-1/4", maybe move the perches but definitely wouldn't cut it down.

On the 8-3/4", search craigslist for big project car sales. They are from a thing called junkyards. Still plenty out there from $125. (just most have centralized)

MoPar parts can get hard to find, not everyone is happy side-lining the car. I'm not. I have a 8-3/4" in the Dart and an 8-1/4" in the Aspen. Both small-blocks, both Torqueflites but I'm much less worried about a Ford rear than I am about a Chevy engine in the car. Or trans. (they have both taken up some stretched reputations, both are kinda silly) The Ford rear's reputation comes fully from fact. It is cheaper to get a 9" from under a 'stang, beef it up, and swap it in place of an 7-1/4" than to get an 8-3/4" in an A-body's case. That is the only car I'd do it on. Mostly since the 8-3/4"s need to be built to really get to the point of being great. There is NO other Chrysler product I would ever do it with besides an A-body with a 7-1/4" that had to be LBP.

F-bodies can get 8-3/4"s easily enough, 8-1/4"s are fine for a fair amount of power and are dirt cheap, 9-1/4"s work great in trucks and bigger cars, but I think the 9" is a great choice for a hi-po swap from 7-1/4"

I'd probably say the 8-1/4" would be better than the 8.8", it could bridge the gap until you can get an 8-3/4" housing anyway. I can get one anyday of the week for $125 ready to go in the car.

[frostnettenes]

By the way, I've had an 8.25 in my '72 Dart (440 powered) since 1994. It lasted through numerous 12-second quarter runs (the car didn't hook up at all, which is why it's probably never grenaded), through my late teen years of running the hell out of it, and probably 20,000 miles later, still has tight clutches and makes absolutely zero noise. A lot of people who have never ran one say they aren't stout enough to hold up for long, but I'd not hesitate to run one behind another A-body with under 600 ft. lbs of torque. As for a 7.25, I killed two of them in slant six daily drivers, so I wouldn't even think about one behind a stock 340, let alone a big block.

It had totally slipped my mind about the late-70's tilt columns found mostly in Cordobas; good point. Look at it this way; while my other Dart is sitting in the garage, somebody will have an 8.8 in their Dart and on the road. I have no problem knowing that. To each their own. If I had a spare 8.75, trust me- I'd offer to sell it to anyone who needed one. Unfortunately, mine is the only one I know of anywhere near where I live. Hopefully flyboy01 finds one before going with the Fjord rear.

[67Dart34dr0]

I think new axles, a 29 spline carrier, and the right gears could make an 8-1/4" live up to serious HP.

I know of a real 340 Duster with a built 360 that has its stock 8-1/4" in it (its 340 needs a rebuild and is outta the car), seems to have held up well enough. Don't know what kinda beating its had.

[joesnow]

Everyone thinks alittle differant. But I stick by my earlier opion of not using the 9 1/4" My opion they are junk.

1st choice Dana 60 truck rear cut down ( never look back)
2nd 8 3/4" C,E,B or tuck cut down
These would fir w/o cutting

3Rd ford 9" Cougar '67,'68'69 (Tell people it ran w/ NASCAR. They use 9' Ford)
4th 8.8" ford
5Th Ford 8"  Maverick,mustang, cougar,Fairmont,Falcon, Pinto(use 5 lug axles),MustangII

I have learned life is full of comprimise.

[440GoldDuster]

Well don't mean to upset anyone being a newbie, but I've located an 8.8 out of a '97 Explorer,disc brakes, 4:10 LSD, for $100.00. I'm going to get it and try it I'll post pics when I can until then I'll be 

[loiq]

Part of the problem with your theory, more Dana 60 were installed in Fords that even in a Mopar, so if we use mopar only rears, then its an 8 3/4 only, so what wrong with a ford rear, what about abodyjoe, he is running ford wheels on a Mopar, some people run GM disc brakes on theri 8 3/4's. Honestly, I am a Mopar-or-no-car man myself, but so much stuff is non mopar, it hardly matters. If a mopar can kick the arse of a Mustang using an 8.8 rear end, whats the harm?

ANother thing to consider, I have been looking for an 8 3/4 A-body housing for 2 years, I have the axles, backing plates, carrier, and two sets of drums, but still no housing, since they are as rare as hen's teeth, I am starting to look and the 8.8 rears as a viable choice. Especially since it is easier than cutting down a 9 1/4 or B-body rear. And as of last check, I found a 3.73 LS 8.8 rear with brakes for $200 on Craigslist last week.

I just sold an early B body 8.75 for $50.